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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Nov 28, 2012 6:54:46 GMT -5
Unfortunately releases are tied with what is selling, as GW is controlled by shareholders... so they have to pump out what sells... with 8th edition they lost ALOT of fantasy players unfortunately (it's too bad too, as I can see where they were going with things - and it worked with 40k, I just wish they didn't use WHFB as a testing ground!)
so when fantasy dropped in sales... so too dropped the releases...
just look online, there are a billion rumours about 40k... finding the fantasy ones is more than a little difficult!
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Post by stonecutter on Nov 28, 2012 7:55:50 GMT -5
As both a Bret (2003) and Woodelf (2005) player, I definitely feel the pain when it comes to waiting for a book update. That being said, I went through a similar experience to Shannon with regard to magic nearly ruining the game for me along with a few other annoyances and then I simply "got over it". More and more tourneys are putting restrictions on magic to bring more balance into the game and I have no doubt that the next edition will bring the eight main lores into line with the 8th ed book lores. I find our local solution of simply banning #6 spells from the main book a simple and effective remedy that makes the game more tactical and enjoyable. With regard to model counts, I have begun to experiment with a solution - the unit filler. This offers an excellent opportunity for modelling/conversions to bring a cool look to the army while also saving the cost and tedium of assembling another three dozen rats/gobbos/halberdiers/executioners, etc.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Nov 28, 2012 10:07:52 GMT -5
.... and in some cases (ie: Franks' use of the cauldron of blood as a unit filler for his executioners) it really just looks a lot cooler than the same static poses over and over...
I'm doing the same with my hammerers (all in one static pose) using High King Thorgrim as a unit filler... because he's 780 points of suck (so when am I going to use this guy EVER?) but a really cool model on a base that replaces 6 hammerers.... and I got him for dirt cheap at one of the past Nexus auctions....
For horde armies especially (skaven, vamps, goblins etc) or those that use expensive metal models, or ones with limited poses, unit fillers are a great idea to save money and add interest in the units...
so yeah, totally agree with Frank on this one... (and need to use it myself more!)
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Post by fritzthedwarf on Nov 28, 2012 10:47:37 GMT -5
onlurker - yeah it can be hard to balance armies in a game like 40k (and it is less hard to not try much at all), but I never understand why so many customers are so willing to accept poor product/rules from GW because good things also come out. I have played wargames/RPG/tabletop games for almost 40 years and have never seen a company such as GW get away with so much for what they do to their customers - and the poor product/rules are defended by their customers.
No one is asking for perfect balance - I agree that would be a nightmare in a continually changing game with so many varied units/wargear. However it is not that difficult to make a reasonable effort at internally and externally balancing a dex. There are many players with an in depth knowledge of the game (locally Tom, Shannon, Ray, etc) that could in an afternoon produce a good, detailed errata to fix up many of an army's imbalances. Look at the Hive Tyrant in the nid dex. It has 4 ranged weapons you could take, but since the dexes release TL devourers have been the main choice that is normally seen, because the other weapons stats/point cost was not balanced within the dex or within the game rules for what the weapon did. 6th changed nothing and the errata changed nothing either. The list goes on and on.
Look at the plastic Hive Tyrant/Swarmlord kit. GW made the devourers the go to ranged weapon (usually 2 sets) for a tyrant and included none in the new kit. On top of that, if you want to make a flyrant with say lashwhip and bonesword and stranglethorn cannon (or any ranged weapon) you have to convert the model right out of the box. This is not some unusual build - this is poor design on GWs part for a new kit. Yes the wings are great and other bits are fine. Yes GW makes some good kits like raveners and gargoyles that don't need any converting or have missing parts to make the normal model. But they have too many examples like the above. GW should not be let off the hook when they botch things just like they can be given praise when doing something good.
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Post by harryf on Nov 28, 2012 10:52:35 GMT -5
and I got him for dirt cheap at one of the past Nexus auctions.... so yeah, totally agree with Frank on this one... (and need to use it myself more!) nexus has auctions?
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Nov 28, 2012 13:13:22 GMT -5
had... on occasions in the past... not lately....
and this would be for old product that had been sitting around... not current kits...
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Post by fritzthedwarf on Nov 28, 2012 13:50:09 GMT -5
Apart from my annoyance at GW in both systems (since their shenanigans apply to both), I should dig out my Dwarfs again. The banning of the #6 spells was a good way to address the over-the-top magic as that was one of the things that turned me off 8th edition. Who knows, maybe Dwarfs are in the pipe for an update in the next year?! Would love to see some plastic hammerers and iron breakers (and maybe new plastic warriors). I read a rumour somewhere that Dwarfs might get a golem and/or an airship (although sounds cool hopefully not too big to be too bulky for game purposes).
What point levels are you guys playing at these days in fantasy?
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Nov 28, 2012 15:25:48 GMT -5
2400 is the standard lately... makes the math easy
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Post by stonecutter on Nov 28, 2012 21:28:31 GMT -5
We'd love to see you and the stunties out for a Thursday Mark. With the laser guided artillery, dwarves are a real menace to the big monsters that are so common ;D
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Post by fritzthedwarf on Nov 29, 2012 11:04:20 GMT -5
The Dwarfs wont be able to make an appearance today (I'm playing Guy 40k), but I plan to bring them out for next week to shake off the dust and start relearning 8th.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Nov 29, 2012 11:55:35 GMT -5
I'll try and settle a few grudges on your behalf Mark... no worries
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Post by connor on Nov 29, 2012 16:17:00 GMT -5
if you are ever free friday I'm happy to play a fantasy game with you.
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Post by nsc on Dec 12, 2012 7:29:12 GMT -5
40k is more popular because it gets more support from GW and non-wargaming endeavors, as Tom pointed out there are a lot of 40k Novels.
On top of that THQ has pumped out a number of very successful video games which draw people into the setting, which most people fall in love with because there is so much depth. There's literally something for everyone.
Yes, I know creative assembly has Total War: Warhammer Fantasy slated for release 2013-2014 (and I am so excited) but that's not the same as seven Dawn of War games and Space Marine.
Furthermore (while a recent development) Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay competes directly with D&D, while Dark Hersey stands alone, and as mentioned, the 40k setting has a lot more depth due to the nature of science fiction.
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Post by thesanityassassin on Dec 23, 2012 2:23:14 GMT -5
Really? Total War: Warhammer will exist? I harrassed them with e-mails about that like 3 years ago and they told me to bugger off they weren't doing it. This is the happiest day of my life if this is true. Well...not really, but a pretty damn good day.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Dec 23, 2012 9:43:20 GMT -5
they just waited long enough to safely say "It wasn't Matt's idea... we thought of it!"
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