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Post by Jack Shrapnel on May 21, 2021 11:32:18 GMT -5
couple more GT's show that the dark kin are getting knocked down a peg: www.goonhammer.com/competitive-innovations-in-9th-lightning-round-20-05-drukhari-thoughts/some interesting armies here that have adapted to the big shift in meta that DE have brought. (and no first place wins for DE) Still think that liquifier dark technomancer lists are going to be hit with a savage nerf, and rightfully so. But it does seem that while we're waiting for the inevitable nerf-hammer from GW, players at the GT level at least, are starting to adapt. |
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Post by voodoo on May 22, 2021 6:21:09 GMT -5
The telling line in that article for me was "the armies in the top spots are Drukhari, anti-drukhari or those that are able to dodge them. "
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on May 22, 2021 6:37:06 GMT -5
it's dark technomancer liquifier spam that's the problem. GW nerfs that and DE come immediately in line (nearly every problematic list spammed them).
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Post by Frosty the Pirate on May 23, 2021 11:24:59 GMT -5
This seems to happen with some Aeldari factions when they first get their book in a new edition. They come out of the gates swinging hot, and it takes some time before people figure out how to adapt and the lists normalize a bit.
DE's traditional counters are usually Astra Militarum and Craftworlds, both of which have had zero rumormill activity other than The First And Only box that just was announced. I wouldn't be surprised to see Admech help de-throne DE a little given their update through, as Goonhammer seems to think Mars will be popular with their volume of mid-strength firepower.
That said, I haven't seen "the liquifier combo" in action yet in a battle report, so I also haven't seen first-hand how ridiculous it is.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on May 23, 2021 12:34:19 GMT -5
it's so nasty and oppressive I'd never run it... it can nearly table someone turn one.
makes the old iron hands look tame.
If you ever want to experience it, I can show you on TTS what it does.
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Post by LizardTau on May 23, 2021 12:44:18 GMT -5
makes the old iron hands look tame. Wow that's saying something. They were pretty crazy. I never played them to this full nastiness but I still felt bad half the time I played them. |
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Post by Frosty the Pirate on May 23, 2021 15:55:28 GMT -5
What I was trying to say is I've not yet seen like a breakdown of how the combo works. I've kind of been under a rock lately the last couple weeks and haven't quite caught up yet.
A tldr or a link to a bat rep would be handy if someone has one
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Post by Typhus on May 23, 2021 16:22:31 GMT -5
What I was trying to say is I've not yet seen like a breakdown of how the combo works. I've kind of been under a rock lately the last couple weeks and haven't quite caught up yet. A tldr or a link to a bat rep would be handy if someone has one The Dark Technomancers subfaction trait lets you give a unit +1 to wound and +1 Damage with any or all of its ranged weapons, but for each hit roll of 1 it suffers 1 mortal wound (or d3 mortal wounds if it's a vehicle/monster). Liquefiers are 12" Assault d6 S4 AP-2 D1, and they automatically hit. Dark Eldar have a variety of cheap, durable units with access to Liquefiers that zip around the board in cheap, durable open-topped transports and make life hell for everyone. |
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on May 23, 2021 16:52:26 GMT -5
Essentially you can put two liquifiers in a 5 man wrack unit (as the champ can take one). You can put two of these units in a raider. So the raider's dark lance covers your anti-tank, and with aethersails strat you can be in the opponent's deployment zone firing 4D6 S4, AP-2 D2 damage autohits that are +1 to wound.
repeat that combo four more times (raiders/wracks)
You then put 3 grotesques also in a raider, also each having a liquifier gun
You can also take a big unit of 5+ grots in the webway, also each having a liquifier gun.
I think one of the lists I saw had over 20 of the damn things, all either in the webway or in raiders. Even death guard with their -1 damage cannot withstand that kind of massive firepower.
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Post by LizardTau on May 23, 2021 16:53:37 GMT -5
Ahh cheap units that can hold 2 damage, ap -2, plus one to wound flamers would be pretty tough.
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Post by Frosty the Pirate on May 25, 2021 8:04:36 GMT -5
Yeah I can see that being really nasty. I've seen first hand how horrific mass S4 AP-2 D1 shooting is at lower points levels with Hail Of Doom + Jinx, so I can imagine auto-hitting and +1 to wound would get out of hand quickly, especially since the lack of transports in the metagame atm would only compound this issue for most armies (Not to mention DE also have access to some excellent anti-tank options)
After more reading this weekend I think Admech might help tip the scales back a bit, their rework seems to provide all the tools required to keep Drukhari in check.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on May 25, 2021 9:30:15 GMT -5
plus damage two... I'm honestly not sure what GW was thinking with dark technomancers... It was a problem last book, and given how tooled up the current codex is, this is just a huge misstep. Given EVERY dominating DE list is running dark technomancer liquifier spam, this is most certainly a big problem.
I fully believe that this will be completely nerfed though, which is why I'm not even bothering trying to run it. Plus you know, it's like 0% fun for your opponent to get tabled or nearly so on turn one.
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Post by Frosty the Pirate on May 25, 2021 10:32:20 GMT -5
I won't speculate on "band aid quick fixes" cus that really won't go anywhere useful, but looking at the way the rule works it's definitely an easy-to-nerf rule. I'll assume they'll look at the data for 2-3 months first to see if the meta simply adapts on it's own, but this screams it's getting nerf-hammered the same way Smash Captains did for example.
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