Tournament Scoring -"Talking it out"

[fumj79]

Interesting read, 

bloodofkittens.com/blog/2023/02/17/actually-lets-not-talk-this-out/

[distractedcarnifex]

I have reservations about "talking it out", although I have certainly done it. Its one thing to talk out the final turn since you know the 1st player's Primary score and it can be simple to work out what the player going second will have in terms of Primary. Secondaries not based on doing something to the opponent can also be estimated.

I don't think, though, it is a good practice to talk out multiple turns and situations when probabilities come into play. There certainly be score inflation for both parties, or a veteran player "jedi mind tricking" a new player.

Some major tournaments explicitly ban "talking it out." 

[Jack Shrapnel]

I normally talk things out in a tournament if it gives my opponent more points if they're new, or if it's really obvious what happens and we both agree. (or if one person is tabled, it's easier to talk out what would happen the remaining turns rather than walk through everything)

[mrmanstory]

I don't mind talking things out in a tournament game though I do see the point of "inflating points".

I don't think people should need to talk out most of their games at tournaments more than 1 turn but I will admit sometimes it isn't even really in your control. I've played some games where it felt no matter how fast I played my speed wouldn't be matched by my opponent (it happens rarely but I'm sure everyone's had it at least once) it definitely can feel unfortunate needing to talk out a game when you feel you've done your best to keep pace.

[harryf]

I think in general there's two types of "talking out"

Case 1: There weren't enough time to finish (assuming both players played at a similar pace), there's a turn or two to go, both armies are pretty chewed up or one side is functionally tabled, the remaining scoring can be easily tallied. This type of talking out I like provided its not excessive back and forth time wasting arguing, because it doesn't rob anyone of gameplay.

Case 2: One side believes that they are reasonably sure what the results will be, and tries to pressure the other side into conceding without the time even close to running out so they can save time and go prep for next match. I think this is what this article is talking about. This type of talking out I dislike because its one player attempting to rob the other player their room for outplay/good luck.

[Hi I'm Derek]

In every case where I've had to talk out games it's because we just didn't get there on time. It would be ideal if you didn't have to do this my god do I not see any viable alternatives in the current framework, for all the reasons in the article.

If I play someone at my level we might just barely squeak the full 5 turns if we really push, it's really not easy these days (you can see when pro players are talking out games how hard it might be for the rest of us to consistently finish with time on the clock).

[lightcavalier]

My biggest issue with talking it out is the effect it has on other games/events as a whole

Nothing like actually finishing you game and winning, but being out scored by some ppl who only got to mid turn 3 then talked out turns 4 and 5 (as most ppl are fairly generous w each other talking it out)

It can cause just as much feels bad for pther ppl as timing out can

[fumj79]

Yeah the whole topic kinda feels strange to me because I played competitive magic for a quite few years where it is a bit more definitive. Best 2 out of 3 games. If the round ends before all 3 games are finished 1-0 is a win, 1-1 is a draw even if game 3 is in progress. Although to be fair there was a decent amount of concessions and or prize splitting in top 8's.