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Post by Typhus on Jun 28, 2023 14:28:02 GMT -5
I mean, I'm not really seeing a huge issue if it works both ways I liked Auspex's suggestion that Towering be eliminated and just let everyone hide behind Ruins - then it would still work both ways, without making a lot of household terrain setups de facto "planet bowling ball" when Knights get involved. I know I own a lot of ruins, and they're generally riddled with big gothic windows. |
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Post by raceygaming on Jun 28, 2023 14:53:51 GMT -5
I have also seen towering " if this model toes into a ruin it counts as being fully within"
So it just has to touch to ignore so it can do one but not more than one
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jun 28, 2023 16:28:23 GMT -5
Has anyone locally played as or against towering? How did it go?
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Post by question on Jun 28, 2023 17:10:43 GMT -5
I have no problem with true LOS. As long as it cuts both ways, why not? So for those who remember and still have them, maybe you want to dig out those old laser pointers. They certainly help in definitively resolving those "yes they can, no they can't see" disputes.
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Post by sean on Jun 29, 2023 11:07:45 GMT -5
I also hope they just eliminate towering, let all models hide behind terrain. Otherwise it just lends itself to the Alpha Strike deciding the game. Which is what all the terrain obscuring rules, WTC terrain, etc.... was trying to eliminate. It's no fun losing turn 1, whether you play with knights or against them.
The other problem with Imperial knights is that they are just 5-10% undercosted. Especially if you think their army rule is re-roll all 1's to hit and wounds, and not just a single 1 to hit and wound.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jun 29, 2023 12:28:22 GMT -5
Not sure it's JUST towering that is causing issues....
for example currently Imperial Knights have a 65% win rate while Chaos knights have a 45% win rate
They're both knights... and they're both towering... so there's something else at play as well.
And we can all agree there's a BIG difference between the results that Stompas are getting vs. Wraithknights
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Post by voodoo on Jun 29, 2023 14:27:09 GMT -5
Yeah, there's a LOT of "YMMV" (your mileage may vary) in towering units right now. I do agree it's not a simple "all towering models are problems" because... the Stompa. He's sadly like the Wraithknight that ate lead paint chips as a kid.
Not even knights were created equal, because an army wide FNP and more re-rolls is "shockingly" (not really) better than Battleshock snenanigans.
If ti continues to be a problem, then GW will handle it; the edition is just now a week old, give them a few minutes to adjust things. lol
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Post by sean on Jun 29, 2023 19:04:09 GMT -5
Let's be clear too that it is not the Wraith Knight, it's the "heavy wraith cannon" that's the issue. And putting it on a towering platform that you can't hide from is exacerbating the issue.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jun 29, 2023 19:59:54 GMT -5
Let's be clear too that it is not the Wraith Knight, it's the "heavy wraith cannon" that's the issue. And putting it on a towering platform that you can't hide from is exacerbating the issue. I think devastating wounds combined with fate dice seems a bit over the top... fate dice should count as modified dice rolls, would instantly scale back the deadliness of this gun. |
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Post by sean on Jun 30, 2023 8:56:42 GMT -5
Yes that would be a great change. Although I even think the change should be on Devastating wounds, that it is only on a natural roll of a 6, and not on anything that "counts as a natural roll of a 6" But that might be hard for people to understand.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jun 30, 2023 9:00:25 GMT -5
Well the latest metawatch on warcom called out Towering, fate dice, and indirect as being adjusted next week along with points.
So looks like they're paying attention.
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Post by Frosty the Pirate on Jun 30, 2023 11:03:42 GMT -5
Given they directly called out desolation Marines as quote "hugely undercosted for what they can do", I'd hold off on ordering any beyond what you got in Leviathan boxes for now...
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Post by voodoo on Jun 30, 2023 11:15:11 GMT -5
There aren't any in the Leviathan boxes; they were in a prior one if I'm not mistaken; but yeah, I wouldn't bank on them being the same price in a few days as they are now. Or, I'd expect them to get a decent alteration to their rules to be able to keep them at their current points.
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Post by ohgodsnakes on Jun 30, 2023 11:22:10 GMT -5
They were in the boxset with the Brutalis dread that came out some months ago.
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Post by Hi I'm Derek on Jun 30, 2023 11:23:34 GMT -5
Yarp they came out of the brutalis dread combo box. People wanted the brutalis dread but a ton of tshirt cannons ended up getting traded around for aesthetic reasons and snapped up by comp players (they were super efficient in 9 too lol)
Edit: beat me to it
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