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Post by thesanityassassin on Jan 15, 2011 10:23:42 GMT -5
Make a random team at the start and it lasts throughout the tournament. It can be a lot of fun, but it can occasionally cause trouble if two players/armies get matched up that prove unbeatable. This has happened before in 40k tourneys....
It also makes list building for fantasy a little more conservative as you can't be sure what kind of magic or shooting or whatnot your opponent has. IE you can't simply combine a Dwarf gunline with Swordsmasters and an Archmage and hit go.....you might find yourself completely lacking a shooting or magic phase.
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Post by thesanityassassin on Jan 15, 2011 10:27:21 GMT -5
Oh, I didn't notice that voting for "partner changes each round". That just....honestly seems like a mess from organizational standpoint to me, but if you want to take it on Shannon, more power to you. How would the scoring work on such a thing?
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jan 15, 2011 12:54:19 GMT -5
My chaos idea was that even though it's a tag team each individual would get scores... so we'd still have one best overall, general, etc. Was thinking that your sportsmanship score would be rated by not only your opponent but your partner. This would give a wider range in sports scores, and alleviate some "unbeatable" partnerships, or getting stuck with a partner who's army just doesn't work with yours - wrecking your competitive chances just through bad matchup... also you'd have to be nice to your partner
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Post by aardusxx on Jan 15, 2011 14:26:20 GMT -5
I'm Wesley, came to the last 40k tourney. Sign me up please but only if we are going to do tag-team, haven't been into fantasy long enough to amass a 2400 point army.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jan 15, 2011 17:07:54 GMT -5
It's official, we're at at least 12... it will be a tag team...
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Post by danydaigle24 on Jan 15, 2011 18:32:56 GMT -5
random or pick your partner
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jan 15, 2011 19:26:08 GMT -5
well so far they're neck and neck in the votes! (figured 8 to 1 meant tag team pretty safely though)
Advantages to pick your partner is that you can make a bunch of combos that might overcome your army's weaknesses (ie: Warriors teamed up with some dwarf shooting) and you get paired with someone you probably get along with.
Random is nice for countering some of the min-maxing that can occur when people can pick their partner, and therefore pick combos that can be pretty rough. Also if you don't necessarily know someone to partner with it doesn't really matter as you get set up on the day of the tourney.
So there's definite advantages in both systems. As the ringer army I'll bring a 1200 and a 2400 list so if we're at odd numbers I can balance it out.
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Post by thesanityassassin on Jan 15, 2011 19:53:41 GMT -5
The more I think about it the more I think the Chaos thing would be cool if you think the scoring will work out...it might be a bit tricky to balance though. That will keep the nasty combos away, but still mean that you're not stuck with an army/person you're not thrilled with playing with for the WHOLE tourney.
I'd allocate a little more time for each game though, to give players a few minutes to make a game plan before hand.
The only big problem I foresee with it would be how to set the team-ups in later rounds while keeping the winners v winners thing going and making sure all the match ups follow that path.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jan 20, 2011 10:55:04 GMT -5
Okay - decision made First post is updated - any questions (or if you'd like to sign up - we've got lots of open slots being a tag team!) post here....
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Post by stonecutter on Jan 20, 2011 13:30:04 GMT -5
With regard to battle scoring and pairings, here is my suggestion based on having run a similar concept several years ago:
1) Never Trust an Elf - scoring is tiered along the usual lines but additional points are given out each round to reflect whose army has the most troops remaining on the ground along with any banners they are holding. With 4 players, scoring is 4,3,2,1 (or a multiple thereof) and added to their battle score. The best part is it really makes for tricky alliances since your partner may decide to let you "take one for the team" ;D It is the simplest approach and also provides more differentiation so that the next round is different.
2) Pairings - Essentially standard Swiss system but there are two options: Option 1 - Top Tier: Pairings are based on battle scores and opponents taken directly from the rank order in groups of 4. Works as follows: #1 & #4 versus #2 & #3 #5 & #8 versue #6 & #7 etc. Works well and all four players are roughly equal in ability in each group (either by lucky army design, generalship or a combination). Main drawback is not a lot of movement in overall rankings and similar people in the same pools.
Option 2 - Polar Opposites: Successively take top and bottom ranked players and pair them. So, if there are 12 players it would go as follows:
#1 & #12 versus #2 & #11 #3 & #10 versus #4 & #9 #5 & #8 versus #6 & #7
This approach provides a real challenge and makes huge swings in rank order "normal". Another benefit is that it is most likely to result in pairing more experienced players with less experienced players.
Well, that is all I have to add. See you tonight.
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Post by darkken20 on Jan 20, 2011 14:51:47 GMT -5
ok i like the option 2 but for first turn it should be six 1200 singles battles to find out who is where in the rating or random partner for the fist round
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jan 20, 2011 15:40:31 GMT -5
Each round will be tag team... so no sorting that way Ken but we've been doing this long enough to know who most of our experienced players are, and I'll be matching up round one at least along those lines.... round two and three I had already looked at matching according to the second option Frank had mentioned as well "polar opposites" as the intent of the tag team isn't to create a super-tag-team-of-broken-combos but having those who win create a better and better tagteam by the end. As much as I like your suggestion of "never trust an elf"... kind of discourages teamwork and more along the lines of sacrifice your friend doesn't it? could make an interesting mix if your partner grades your sportsmanship too though I'll give that one more thought....
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Post by aardusxx on Jan 20, 2011 19:23:07 GMT -5
could you put "Liam" down for the tournament?
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Jan 20, 2011 23:01:20 GMT -5
certainly... he's added
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Post by thesanityassassin on Jan 21, 2011 18:09:38 GMT -5
I'm really thinking of bringing something absurd to this one....
How many Swordsmasters can one fit in 1200 points after the 300 of core and a bare bones Hero? =P
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