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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Dec 11, 2012 21:46:07 GMT -5
Honor guard version (from Tom's advice)
HQ:
Dante
Librarian - power armor, jump pack, force axe, shield/lance
5 Honour guard: 4x melta, jump packs
5 Honour guard: 3x plasma, 1x melta, jump packs
Elite:
Sanguinary priest with jump pack
Troops:
5 Sanguinary guard - 2 infernus pistols, power fist 5 Sanguinary guard - 2 plasma pistols, power fist 5 Sanguinary guard - 2 plasma pistols, power fist 5 Sanguinary guard - 2 plasma pistols, power fist 5 Sanguinary guard - 2 plasma pistols, power fist
2,000 points, 38 models - 26 of which have a 2+
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Post by danydaigle24 on Dec 11, 2012 22:43:53 GMT -5
Yeah but you still run good list, I never saw one of your list that was terrible and woulnt win a single game...
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Post by Frosty the Pirate on Dec 12, 2012 7:43:39 GMT -5
I like what tom has gone for in this version, but you've given up the banner which is honestly a huge army wide buff.
The plasma pistols are kinda like a "huh?" for me. I see why they are there, but isn't generally shooting something before you charge it just a horrible idea? Especially given that you have far more killing power (through at AP3) in assault?
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Post by calitom on Dec 12, 2012 18:15:50 GMT -5
He needs to be able to handle vehicles, and if he's 12'' away he's not charging someone, hence the plasma pistols. Plus he can actually shoot 26 plasma shots at flyers if required.
What army wide buff does the banner give Ray? The banner only gives +1 attack to the unit it's in and a morale bubble for rerolls, but the entire army is fearless...
In either case once you understand that upgrading an elite army too much shoots you in the foot you can start building a list that is going to hopefully be able to handle the myriad of infantry spam lists that are common now in 6th edition...
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Post by danydaigle24 on Dec 12, 2012 19:10:59 GMT -5
I think plasma pistol are useless and I would go infurnus pistol instead. Are you really gonna handle a tank with a S7 shoot against AV13?...
Also honor guard brings nothing to the list I would rather stick to DC with Astro at less they were scary...
Banner is not necessary I agree.
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Post by calitom on Dec 13, 2012 2:42:36 GMT -5
6'' Range is realllllly bad unless if you're in Dante's unit. the honor guard add special weapons which the list desperately needs and priest bubbles as separate targets from your SG.
Plasma pistols have the 12'' range which is what you want so you can actually do something when you can't charge (Let's be honest, 12'' isn't worth eating overwatch for.)
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Post by nsc on Dec 13, 2012 3:03:57 GMT -5
Let's be honest, 12'' isn't worth eating overwatch for. Hush, you'll ruin my strategy, I'm going to bait opponents into extreme charges and convince them to declare it, then shoot them out of charge range with overwatch. It's infallible!
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Dec 13, 2012 6:39:38 GMT -5
the only thing I'm not sure of with the plasma pistols, is those few shots at increased range (since they can't rapid fire) going to actually make much of a difference overall... let's face it, my ranged anti-tank is basically non-existent!
totally agree that 6" range is horrible though!
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Post by calitom on Dec 13, 2012 7:07:08 GMT -5
You're mostly going to be using the plasma pistols for anti infantry and anti MC. The Melta HG and dante's unit are there to handle the most immediate armored threat.
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Dec 13, 2012 7:49:01 GMT -5
Well I'm under no illusions that the list is going to be all that, but I'm hoping it will be mid-tier competitive, like a 50-50 rate or something... you know, something I can play and have fun with and have close, tactical games... that's the goal... at first it will likely be removing handfuls of expensive models going "what was I thinking? "
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Post by danydaigle24 on Dec 13, 2012 11:04:20 GMT -5
I dont see why 6 inches is horrible when you can DS with Descent of Angel... I think Plasma pistol is horrible because you cant charge with it and wont do anything and might even kill your guys.. A good player will make sure is best armor will be protect before Dante is coming in and if you DS them in the middle of his army to destroy one single armor good luck for surviving after... Anyways is by trying that you will see
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Dec 13, 2012 12:17:10 GMT -5
Why can't you charge with it? it's a pistol, not a plasma gun... they're not rapid fire...
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Post by Frosty the Pirate on Dec 13, 2012 12:34:01 GMT -5
If I'm wrong about the chapter banner giving +1 attack within a 6"/12" radius then I'll admit that dropping it is the right move. (I was sure it was the same thing as the Sang's aura)
I would almost want to put melta on both of the HGs, gives you 2 anti-armour pieces instead of 1.
I'm still iffy on the Plasma Pistols tho. Honestly, Str 7 is ok against AV11/12, but really pretty poor vs AV13, and you really don't have the volume of shots to make it work.
I say try it, but I think you'd be better off with another fist or some other upgrades instead of the pistols.
A note about the infernus, is that yes 6" of range is very short, but when you only scatter D6 due to DOA it becomes a little less random. So it theory it could actually work just as well, as long as you aren't trying to get inside that 3" melta range (which honestly I used fusion pistols on my harlies for a while, and found I would NEVER get within 3")
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Post by Jack Shrapnel on Dec 13, 2012 12:44:31 GMT -5
thing is though... if you're not getting inside the 3" melta range, is the one point extra strength on the shot worth more than doubling the range of the attack?
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Post by Frosty the Pirate on Dec 13, 2012 12:49:37 GMT -5
That's what I don't know. It will totally depend on how easily you can close the gap on your opponents. Those jump packs and how you use them will make all the difference in the world
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